Zezo forum:

Post by GeGaX | 2018-03-02 | 19:51:54

Hello,
Good news for all of us, the wind limit on VR will drop
(what will be the new value we do not know yet)

49 Comments

Post by marcusbelgicus | 2018-03-02 | 21:24:51

I cannot believe that....The effect of Loic Peyron?

Post by YourMomSA | 2018-03-02 | 21:44:55

Wow. Any idea if it applies to all events or just some? It'll suck for those of us trying to finish JVT if those who went before us has the limit and we don't.

Post by GeGaX | 2018-03-02 | 21:49:57

I do not know any more sorry

Post by zezo | 2018-03-02 | 21:56:24

If memory serves me right the minimum wind speed is global, i.e. same for all races. It's also hard-coded and may not be easy to change. Too late and too tired now, will check some files tomorrow.

Post by YourMomSA | 2018-03-02 | 21:56:42

That's ok. Thanks for the information. I just went into that VR thread to make an appeal to them to apply it for new races only. While it's GREAT news, it's only good for races that haven't started yet.

Cvetan... if they apply the change to new races only, will you be able to support that? Or is the 4-kt minimum an all-races-or-none thing for your setup? Either way... anything you can do to notice when they apply it and adjust accordingly would be much appreciated.

It sounds like a limit will still exist... just maybe lower than 4 kts. I believe the limit may be based on problems that happen in low-wind areas with the 1-minute iterations of VRO3, rather than actually being to dumb the game down. If so, then this situation would suggest they've resolved and/or improved some of those problems enough to be able to lower the limit... but my guess is that they'll never be able to remove the minimum windspeed from the game altogether, in the presence of 1-minute iterations. Just a guess, though.

Post by zezo | 2018-03-02 | 22:03:05

I don't have problem with different minimums in different races. VR2 used the same interpolation but with 0.5 knot limit, so there is no technical problem wit that. Pure marketing solution if you ask me.

Post by GeGaX | 2018-03-02 | 22:03:01

Post by zezo | 2018-03-02 | 22:07:51

You can clearly see that this is part of the global game configuration (user account details, actually) rather than boat polar/race config.

Post by YourMomSA | 2018-03-02 | 22:04:34

Thanks, guys. I'm going to freak if the limit suddenly gets lowered in JVT. ;-)

Post by zezo | 2018-03-02 | 22:11:56

It can make some difference for our group in the next 4-5 days. Should not matter in the North Atlantic.

Post by Ursus Maritimus | 2018-03-03 | 13:14:07

I wouldn't mind as my trimaran is safely parked at Nova Zembla after a (still) top 500 spot ;)

Post by GeGaX | 2018-03-02 | 22:10:57

We just have to wait for the announcement of Ceres to know when it will be put in place

Post by marcusbelgicus | 2018-03-02 | 22:43:28

Ceres just mentionned that we should get it already on the clipper, if everything goes right.

Post by Mullionman | 2018-03-03 | 10:03:32

Well it's not there yet in the Clipper. If you move the mouse to the middle of a High or Low pressure system, it reads 4 kts.

Post by WoKeN | 2018-03-03 | 12:01:34

In JVT see still 4 kts South of Falklands

Post by Ursus Maritimus | 2018-03-03 | 15:19:42

New post in the House Club, it's gonna be 2 kts as af tomorrow, for all races (including JVT)
http://forum.virtualregatta.com/topic/5041-modification-de-la-limite-de-vent-faible/

Cvetan, is it be possible to confirm this in the raw log messages tomorrow and than adjust zezo to it?
Would be nice if this can be used in the Clipper before starting.

Glad I chose light sails as one of the options.

Post by zezo | 2018-03-03 | 16:08:54

We should not hit the minimum in this Clipper leg, but I may get stuck badly in the center of a high in the JV if they drop the limit.

Post by Inicio | 2018-03-03 | 15:27:40

"A change to the low wind limit will be made on current and future races.

From now on, the limit set in areas of weak winds (currently set at 4 knots) will be reduced to 2 knots.

The changes will be put in place at the end of the day for the races in progress"

Post by zezo | 2018-03-03 | 15:44:30

Told ya it would take them at least a month to introduce separate limit for different races. May have waited for the JV to finish.

Just drop me a note if you see a wind lower than 4 (or spot the message in the log) and I'll reconfigure the current races.

Post by marcusbelgicus | 2018-03-03 | 16:09:01

The group that just pass the Cape Horn is going to be hurt a lot from what I saw with zezo. And there are a lot of boats nicely positionned. Glad to have decided to stop this attempt a couple of weeks ago (was part of that group).
The ideal time to change this is complicated, there are races all the time. The clipper starts tomorrow then the VOR in 2 weeks time.

Post by Toppen | 2018-03-03 | 16:34:31

The stupidity of VR never stops to surprise me. How many of the new "fantastic" changes in the VRO3 compared to VRO2 has now been reversed after our complaints?
Is it even allowed to change the minimum wind speed limit during ongoing races?
My suggestion is that "Mr Super" changes his zezo nick...
Cvetan, is "Mr Stupid" taken yet?

Unbelievable!

Post by zezo | 2018-03-03 | 17:00:47

Anyone willing to bet if they will get rid of the cards at some point.

Or maybe on WHEN, not IF.

Oh, and it will be announced as a "great news" too.

Post by Toppen | 2018-03-03 | 17:10:10

In a way they already have since the "Discount full options" gives us free use of autosail, WPs etc.
I guess the "Internet Platform Game Candy Crush Specialist Advisor" VR used for the new VRO3 strategy won't get any more assignments...

Post by mak08 | 2018-03-03 | 17:15:45

AccountDetailsRequest now says windMinKts":2.0, and I see 2.0kts wind in the game now (southeast of New Caledonia, VOR leg 6).

Post by zezo | 2018-03-03 | 17:29:57

Change implemented. I'll be in a 2 knot zone in 2-3 hours and see what the server thinks about it.

You have to reload the game UI to see the change, but luckily it crashes every so often so it's not a big issue.

Post by Ursus Maritimus | 2018-03-03 | 19:43:33

So will you change the zezo-router accordingly?
If possible before Clipper start?

Post by Toppen | 2018-03-03 | 17:40:27

The TJV doesn't seem to have any areas below 4 knots yet...

Post by zezo | 2018-03-03 | 17:43:00

It does. See 60 nm West of me. But you have to reload the game from the home page to see it. Just entering the race is not enough because it's in the global config which is read once per session.

Post by Toppen | 2018-03-03 | 17:42:47

Sorry, my bad, it does. I just exited the current race and wnrt back in and that didn't do it but when reloading the game the 2 knot limit was implemented

Post by zezo | 2018-03-03 | 17:43:33

Exactly. See above.

Post by Toppen | 2018-03-03 | 17:53:42

But Cvetan, you never answered my question: is the "Mr Stupid" nick available?
;)

My decision a few months ago to quit VR (when the VOR / Clipper is over) feels better and better... what a "Mickey Mouse" company VR is...

Post by zezo | 2018-03-03 | 18:06:35

I don't think anything beats "Super" as a sign of arrogance and stupidity.

I get emails with the new forum posts, and in the moment I saw the subject "New forum post by Super" part of me instatnlty knew what it will be all about.

Post by Ursus Maritimus | 2018-03-03 | 19:41:06

Cvetan, can you just change his nick without telling in Mr. Stupid?
He probably won't even notice ;)

Post by zezo | 2018-03-03 | 19:59:06

I can do anything. My forum my rules. But "Super" has a specific meaning in french and I'd rather leave the story unedited.

Post by kallemans | 2018-03-03 | 18:12:23

NOT FAIR PLAY at all. Thats all i can say. Not fair....

Post by JohnT | 2018-03-03 | 20:25:23

The aspect of this that seems insanely unfair is implementing the change while the JV is still running. As someone who has played around with software for several tens of years, it would seem to me that a few IF statements and maybe lining up a couple of extra servers would have allowed them to run two wind models in parallel until the end of the month. After all, they certainly don't care about how much memory and resources they consume on the client side...
PS: really upsetting to see Big Bird now creeping along in 2.2 knots in the S. Atlantic...

Post by zezo | 2018-03-03 | 21:33:16

It's about the user interface. The wind limit is a global config variable, not per race.

A graceful migration is possible, but you have to:

1) Add a per-race config variable and set it to 4 knots.
2) release new version of the app
3) Wait 1 month for everyone to upgrade the phone app
4) Start tweaking individual races

There is also a step 0 - You have to care about your users.

Post by lorenzo | 2018-03-03 | 21:44:09

Quote Toppen [The stupidity of VR never stops to surprise me]
fully agree it is simply unbelievable

as you may expect: "Stultorum mater sempiter gravida"

and seems she likes to give birth in VR office, management floor

Post by Caledonia | 2018-03-03 | 22:05:20

Hey nice work on the Latin Lorenzo.
My wife has a qualification in Latin so didn't need to go to Translate.

The timing is unbelievable.
Can't say I am unhappy with the lowering to 2 knots but deepest sympathies to those who are about to be seriously affected by it. I am not affected as I am totally off the pace in JV and not sailing in the Loick race.

Good luck everyone.

Post by zezo | 2018-03-04 | 13:46:50

Haven't heard this one ;-)

But is it a classic proverb or a modern one back-translated to Latin? I could find references in French and Italian, and there is even a research paper by Romanian professor with the same subject.

Post by lorenzo | 2018-03-04 | 19:30:34

Seems that it comes from the popular culture of ancient Rome.
However ancient or modern, unfortunately it is very true
Did not know about the research, I suppose the guy had plenty of subject to write about :-)

Post by zezo | 2018-03-04 | 20:13:04

I'd prefer this formulation, but it boils down to pretty much the same idea:

From Wikipedia:

Hanlon's razor is an aphorism expressed in various ways including

"Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity."

Post by lorenzo | 2018-03-04 | 20:43:17

LOL, that is a good one!

Post by WoKeN | 2018-03-04 | 21:58:41

VR�s motto: Never underestimate the predictability of stupidity.

Post by Ursus Maritimus | 2018-03-09 | 17:17:39

first time sailing below 4 kts. kinda fun, because you have to be really carefully.

And half speed after a tack is like 1.6 kts at the moment. Benefit is you won't be loosing many nm :)

Post by JohnT | 2018-03-09 | 17:38:16

somewhat ironic that power winches still make a big difference when the wind is so light, given that in real life you probably wouldn't even need them ;)

Post by Ursus Maritimus | 2018-03-09 | 17:43:48

sail changes probably make a real boat slow down, just like tacks and gybes will

Post by JohnT | 2018-03-10 | 04:39:32

absolutely agree that all those slow you down; my point was that power winches (or a beefier crew) don't justify the difference in slow-down time in 2 knots: a more complicated/realistic simulation would apply something similar to the foils, where the benefit of power winches was somewhat dependent on wind speed.
But that's not the current game, so all this cheapskate can do is moan about it, and try a pick tactics that merge zezo recommendations, with minimizing maneuvers, and best guesses as to where the forecasters have got it wrong ;)

Post by Ursus Maritimus | 2018-03-10 | 17:08:40

I agree, but than again, that's the game and zezo accounts for it when routing before the race with the various options. And, more sails --> more sail changes --> more penalties --> more benefit from winches